1950-51 DB - Project in the making

Danek1985 · Post by **Danek1985** » Fri Dec 16, 2022 2:15 am

Three Ademirs have played for the Brazilian national team over the years:
Ademir Marques de Menezes-1922 Center Forward Left Winger
Ademir da Guia-1942 Attacking Midfielder, son of Domingos da Guia
Ademir Roque Kaefer-1960 Defensive Midfielder
So the first one is this great footballer from the 50s, a fast and powerful striker, with a strong shot in both feet, Ademir began his career as a left winger before moving to the centre, causing havoc in opposing defenses with his skill and sublime finishing. People at the time considered him an unequaled ball juggler who knew every trick in the book. He used to wreak havoc among defenses with his quick changes in tempo, fooling his opponents with deceptions carried out almost at lightning speed, his mastering of the ball in all situations and the ability to accelerate rapidly. The second one was also a great footballer, he was only 8 years old in 1950, but you can give him, usually a playmaker, he was known for his fantastic close control and passing ability.

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:52 am

Update:

Im getting errors I have no idea what means atm.

I was moving clubs in and out of the French National, something that meant huge changes. There's such a difference in teams exciting back then in France. When I finally finished it, I tried to test the db in the game. When starting the game, I get this error about the French League Cup, and it crashes. Ive not done anything about the cup. I went back to the editor to see what it was, but cant see anything. Then the editor crashed saying "abnormal program termination". This happens every time I open the editor now. Im able to click a bit around before it happens.

The only thing I can think of is that moved PSG down to the lower divs, as they dont even excist in 1950. Maybe the game need them up there?

Alan_v2 · Post by **Alan_v2** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 8:54 am

The French league is very sensitive. You will need to ensure that each club has a correct last position set in the editor that accurately reflects the league structure; i.e. if you are using a 18/20/20 system in france then you would need to have last positions for 1-18 in D1, 1-20 in D2 and 1-20 in Nat. And of course, if a club finished in a relegation place as their last position they would need to be in a Division below in your current database. Also make sure the correct teams are set in the euro.cfg,

As for the error in the editor, that could be one of a zillion things. May be a good idea to run CMSort initially, then load the editor and run the validate tool. Next, save the database in the editor then reload.

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:47 am

Alan_v2 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 8:54 am The French league is very sensitive. You will need to ensure that each club has a correct last position set in the editor that accurately reflects the league structure; i.e. if you are using a 18/20/20 system in france then you would need to have last positions for 1-18 in D1, 1-20 in D2 and 1-20 in Nat. And of course, if a club finished in a relegation place as their last position they would need to be in a Division below in your current database. Also make sure the correct teams are set in the euro.cfg,

As for the error in the editor, that could be one of a zillion things. May be a good idea to run CMSort initially, then load the editor and run the validate tool. Next, save the database in the editor then reload.

Thank you for the response. Ive tried to do the positions, maybe I overlooked something. I'll re-check it. Are you saying there is a way to edit the league structure? Everything is set to default structures, but its quite different from the real.
The euro.cfg I havent looked at, I couldnt figure out how to set the correct teams in Europe.
CMSort i'll look at, I didnt know about that option.

Im used to doing things in the FM editor, but this is quite different

AMC · Post by **AMC** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:52 am

Personally moving teams between leagues should be the last thing you do because of things like this, obviously it's up to you as you're doing the editing but I'd concentrate on the players/staff for now and then worry later about teams being in the right leagues/correct teams playing in Europe.

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:06 am

AMC wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:52 am Personally moving teams between leagues should be the last thing you do because of things like this, obviously it's up to you as you're doing the editing but I'd concentrate on the players/staff for now and then worry later about teams being in the right leagues/correct teams playing in Europe.

I really didn't expected it to be this sensitive. I guess Im learning the hard way. I can still add players though.

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Fri Dec 23, 2022 1:54 pm

I hadn't set the positions for the French National clubs, that seems to have been the issue. Everything looks fine again now. Phew

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Sat Dec 24, 2022 5:14 pm

Merry Christmas Guys

If I've done it right, you should now be able to download version 1

Have a look and see what you think. Give me a message below if you see something wrong or anything

Gibclaret1980 · Post by **Gibclaret1980** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:51 pm

Love the era is the most upto-date file the link in 1st post plz ?

AMC · Post by **AMC** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 8:47 pm

I mean the post before yours (so the last one before you commented), literally states it’s version 1 and that was three days ago, so I’d go with yes.

Gibclaret1980 · Post by **Gibclaret1980** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:29 pm

Been a long christmas haha, i cant seem to get this loaded i've put in where they said loaded it then loaded game and its just showing 89/90 which i had loaded before ? After loading do i need to save it ?

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 7:45 pm

Gibclaret1980 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:29 pm Been a long christmas haha, i cant seem to get this loaded i've put in where they said loaded it then loaded game and its just showing 89/90 which i had loaded before ? After loading do i need to save it ?

You need to press Load custom database then select it and play game when loading is successfull

Alan_v2 · Post by **Alan_v2** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:08 pm

Not sure how much use this will be, but this is the info I can get on Headington United (now Oxford United)

Code: Select all

FN	LN		DD	MM	YYYY	Nationality		Pos
Norman	Aldridge	23	2	1921	England			Full Back
Vic	Barney		3	4	1922	England			Inside Forward
David	Bidois								Right Half
Peter	Buchanan	13	10	1915	Scotland		Outside Right
Hughie	Carr								Outside Left
Jack	Casley		27	4	1926	England			Centre Forward
Sammy	Cheung		16	7	1932	England			Inside Forward
Johnnie	Crichton				England			Left Half
David	Davidson	25	3	1920	Scotland		Centre Half
Ben	Duncan								Inside Left
Jack	Elliott		23	3	1929	England			Outside Right
Alf	Jenkins								Right Half
Ron	Johnston	3	4	1921	Scotland		Centre Forward
David	Johnston							Inside Left
Bert	Kay								Inside Right
Colin	McDonald	15	10	1930	England			Goalkeeper
Cliff	Nugent		3	3	1929	England			Outside Left
Eddie	Quinlan		15	8	1931	England			Outside Left
Frank	Ramshaw					England			Full Back
Bill	Rowston					England			Centre Forward
David	Scott		6	6	1918	Northern Ireland	Goalkeeper
Jim	Smith								Outside Left
Sid	Stanton		16	6	1923	England			Right Half
Fred	Tapping		29	7	1921	England			Full Back
Harry	Thompson	29	4	1915	England			Left Half
Cyril	Toulouse	24	12	1923	England			Centre Half
Gerry	Woodward							Goalkeeper

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:30 pm

Cheers. I'll add them, even though Headington is somewhere in the non-leagues back in the 50's. They joined the football league for the first time in 1962.

All those confusing positions they had back then :O

Where did you find that list btw? Is there more of the same? Finding players belonging to the Conference teams is hard work.

Alan_v2 · Post by **Alan_v2** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:08 pm

This was taken from rageonline.co.uk, the unofficial Oxford United archive site. The image is from oxkits.com

With positions, I did think about converting them closer to modern day tactics, but not suure what you are doing with the database. Key thing is that a full back in 1950 is what we know as an outside centre back today, and most teams played a 3-2-5 system of some sote. This would be a typical Headington line-up:

Code: Select all

                    Rowston

Nugent      Duncan          Barney        Elliott

          Thompson           Bidois

                    Toulouse
     Aldridge                       Ramshaw

                    McDonald

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 10:46 pm

Most of the positions are pure guessing to be honest. The players have to be famous to have the exact positions listed. Most of them are found as defenders, midfielders or attackers.

Most teams used that form yeah, 325 or 235, which means theres gonna be a lot more attackers in this db than usual. A lot.

Gibclaret1980 · Post by **Gibclaret1980** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 11:42 pm

Jay_Goldfire wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 7:45 pm
Gibclaret1980 wrote: ↑Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:29 pm Been a long christmas haha, i cant seem to get this loaded i've put in where they said loaded it then loaded game and its just showing 89/90 which i had loaded before ? After loading do i need to save it ?
You need to press Load custom database then select it and play game when loading is successfull

Thats what i did Goldfire 1950db (standard) and normal db and its loading up 89/90 ?

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Thu Dec 29, 2022 1:59 pm

Weird. Everything works fine on my PC.

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Sat Jan 07, 2023 12:45 pm

New update:

Added players: 2900

But, Ive kinda stopped up a bit. Mainly because Ive almost finished the French Leagues and theres a bit many differences in it to make it playable without huge differences to the CM engine.

One of the biggest issues is the number of players belonging to each team. Back then it was about 15-20 players, due to substitutions not being allowed. And European competitions not being established yet. This means teams are purchasing, and emptying, the lesser teams squads. Another issue is that I cant find information about players belonging to teams down the leagues. In France there was no such thing as French National, the third division and playable division in CM. Back then it was split into four regional amateur leagues, with no promotion. None of these teams have players listed on the web, unless I become fluent in French, which means I have to make my own players. That is fine but the realism is out the window, even though none of the users of this db would know. I expect this to be the tune in all the nations.

AMC · Post by **AMC** » Tue Jan 10, 2023 3:02 pm

AMC wrote: ↑Mon Dec 12, 2022 2:10 pm Great work on the players you've added so far mate, a couple of the positions seem a bit off though and in the case of Di Stefano he seems very underrated (just 10 for finishing).

This maybe a good site for guidance for you, it's for Pro Evolution Soccer but it will help with people's positions and highlight their strengths and weaknesses.

https://pesstatsdatabase.com/

Sadly the forum discussions on players is behind a paywall nowadays but you can still see the stats and handily if you scroll down they've got the different decades so you can select 50s for players from the 50s, although note it's done by people's peak (or maybe decade they played in mostly), so Pele will be in the 60s, Matthews in the 40s etc despite both playing in the 50s too.

This is another site for Pro Evolution Soccer which can offer guidance for players and their strengths/weaknesses.

http://www.pesmitidelcalcio.com/

Note on both sites aggression stat does not mean how aggressive someone is but how much they like to attack and push forward, hence high values for attackers and low values for defensive players.

to maderia · Post by **to maderia** » Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:01 pm

Download isnt working when i press download it says site cant be reached must be expired

Jay_Goldfire · Post by **Jay_Goldfire** » Tue Jan 31, 2023 3:17 pm

Bad news everyone, and sort of good news depending on what you play.

Bad news: Ive stopped builduing this db but I might get back to it later on.

Good news: Ive decided to build it by using the FM Editor.

Reasons: I know my way around the FM editor and can build and rebuild any league structure there. There's also the yearly youth intake and the options to add default players to playable teams. I struggle to find enough players to make the cm editor playable. There's also much easier for others to help out if they want to.